Combat Key Press Priorities



  • As I continue to get into the groove of tanking it's becoming more and more apparent there is an inherent flaw in the combat system having to do with key press priorities. I am unable to activate a defensive ability, such as Stoneskin, if I am in the middle of performing another ability, such as a basic attack.

    I understand not being able to use something like cleave in the middle of an attack, but not being able to use a defensive ability has caused me to approach difficult pulls by basically not attacking so that I can active a defensive. Cleave is the worst offender since it's such a large time commitment before I can use something else.

    Please consider allowing classes to cast non-damaging abilities at any time rather than after the completion of an ability.



  • Personally I think they way it currently works is ok. You can only do one thing at a time so you cannot spam attacks you need to plan ahead.



  • Go tank a couple insane runs then tell me it's okay. It would be fine if there was a gcd system in place but there isn't. And the game already works this way with healing spells so I don't see why it can't work with defensives.



  • I think Being able to cast heals and/or defensives while you attack would make any class with that ability op. I have not consciously tried this on my Cleric but I am pretty sure I cannot attack and heal at the same time. You could completely remove the player from the equation by writing a key hammering bot or just a simple macro that presses all buttons for you. Then one could 'focus' on positioning and spamming the I Win button. Not very challenging. You should talk to your off-tank to take some burden off you so you have time to time your skills.



  • I didn't say attack and heal at the same time. I'm talking about waiting for one action to end before starting another. If someone isn't aware of the nuances of combat and classes then I can see how what I'm asking for wouldn't be fully understood.



  • OK let's try to point out which part I misunderstood

    @Trup said in Combat Key Press Priorities:

    As I continue to get into the groove of tanking it's becoming more and more apparent there is an inherent flaw in the combat system having to do with key press priorities. I am unable to activate a defensive ability, such as Stoneskin, if I am in the middle of performing another ability, such as a basic attack.

    You want to activate one ability while another one already is active, right? Abilities here are everything linked to one of your buttons?

    I understand not being able to use something like cleave in the middle of an attack, but not being able to use a defensive ability has caused me to approach difficult pulls by basically not attacking so that I can active a defensive. Cleave is the worst offender since it's such a large time commitment before I can use something else.

    And the problem is?

    Please consider allowing classes to cast non-damaging abilities at any time rather than after the completion of an ability.

    Non-damaging abilities exclude heals?

    Go tank a couple insane runs then tell me it's okay. It would be fine if there was a gcd system in place but there isn't. And the game already works this way with healing spells so I don't see why it can't work with defensives.

    This is the part that confuses me besides that fact that you tank in a dungeon on insane difficulty which should be -well- insanely difficult ;)
    You start an attack - while this attack is on-going you would also like to perform another action which is non-damaging but not a heal.

    You do not know me and therefore have no right of accusing me of not knowing what I am talking about!



  • I didn't accuse you of anything so relax. You don't see me flying off the handle every time you tell me to 'get gud' or get more players because you think Insane is perfectly balanced and I'm just complaining. So let's be careful when saying who is accusing who here.

    I see that I could have better explained what I'm asking for. I'm going to assume you understand the ideas behind cd, gcd, and not on the gcd. I'm also going to assume you play a Cleric. If all of that is true, then I want Demons Bane and Stoneskin to function the same way as Smite and Regen.



  • @Trup
    I see. I will have to test this when I get back home. I suffer from severe case of altitis so I have all classes at my disposal - but yes my primarys are my cleric and my wizard.
    There's one difference though - all cleric skills are targeted while stoneskin is selftargeted, right? That way you can be sure to cast it on yourself while my Cleric once again will cast regen or divine shield on the ranger that just happened to rush by. In other games people use iframes /ani cancels to achieve what you want. But I have to admit I haven't started looking at possible combos yet.

    I don't think insane is perfectly balanced - it's just very tough. Perfect balance does not exist in MMORPGs. I assume it's safe to say that we two have different views of what balance should look like ;) and we're only talking PvE. Add in PvP and it really would get crazy in here.:laughing:



  • What you'll find is that if Regen is available it will always be used immediately no matter what else is going on. Lesser Heal works the same way. Heal does not. It all doesn't make very much sense.

    I see what you mean about self target only vs open target. Lesser Heal can actually be used on other people and I really wish it wouldn't. It becomes problematic if you're playing with a bunch of other melee for the same reasons you pointed out.

    Insane is hard for all the wrong reasons. I have 335 armor and 13k health unbuffed. A Rogue on Insane can one shot me with Mortal Strike. So my strategy for Rogues is to either charge and bash them and hope they die before stun wears off, or to approach them with my shield raised and wait for them to cast Mortal Strike then attack. My issue is that this strategy doesn't change if I'm solo or with 7 other people. Sure, the range may kill it before it becomes a danger, or someone else can stun it, or whatever other scenario plays out. But I just personally think it's bad design to have stuff like that.

    There's a difference between being stupid on a boss or something and dying because you didn't react properly and just having to fight dozens of mobs that can all use a single ability to kill you. When I solo Hard, those same Rogues drop me to about 10% health. To me, that's good design. It makes them dangerous, makes strategy useful against them, and gives a whole bevy of of things for my group to do. A one shot mechanic just means Mb sits in the back and rezs me when some errant Rogue pops out and kills me or some other group member.



  • @Trup said in Combat Key Press Priorities:

    What you'll find is that if Regen is available it will always be used immediately no matter what else is going on. Lesser Heal works the same way. Heal does not. It all doesn't make very much sense.

    I see what you mean about self target only vs open target. Lesser Heal can actually be used on other people and I really wish it wouldn't. It becomes problematic if you're playing with a bunch of other melee for the same reasons you pointed out.

    Insane is hard for all the wrong reasons. I have 335 armor and 13k health unbuffed. A Rogue on Insane can one shot me with Mortal Strike. So my strategy for Rogues is to either charge and bash them and hope they die before stun wears off, or to approach them with my shield raised and wait for them to cast Mortal Strike then attack. My issue is that this strategy doesn't change if I'm solo or with 7 other people. Sure, the range may kill it before it becomes a danger, or someone else can stun it, or whatever other scenario plays out. But I just personally think it's bad design to have stuff like that.

    There's a difference between being stupid on a boss or something and dying because you didn't react properly and just having to fight dozens of mobs that can all use a single ability to kill you. When I solo Hard, those same Rogues drop me to about 10% health. To me, that's good design. It makes them dangerous, makes strategy useful against them, and gives a whole bevy of of things for my group to do. A one shot mechanic just means Mb sits in the back and rezs me when some errant Rogue pops out and kills me or some other group member.

    OH you getting 1 shot aswell by the rogues on insane eh , lol. Thought I was just having a bad day soloing insane's. Granted more often then not its still my fault for allowing my regen to fall off. Basically I get skill shot an ended with an auto attack before I can respond but I kinda like feeling mortal again :lying_face: Keep in mind I still have close to 70% pierce resist iirc , however even during the pvp days with my 90+ pierce resist sets on I was at times 1 shot by mortal strike, Perhaps that's something the Dev team may want to look into? :eyeglasses:



  • I don't think pierce, slash, or crush is doing anything anymore. I've been stacking armor since the patch and have been doing a much better job at staying alive.



  • @Trup aye but even as far back as when physical resists mattered I was still prone to being 1 shot by mortal strikes via rogues in pvp. With 90+% resist in slash/pierce even back then it essentially made 0 difference , sort of like what you are dealing with now even after stacking massive armor an 13k+ hp pool , so I question mortal strike now.



  • Right. Thankfully you can block it. I've just been trying to get better to reacting to the wind up.



  • Edit: wrong thread.


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